Audley Freed interview
By Kirk West
Hittin' The Note
Issue 22 - October, 1999

Source: http://www.blackcrowes.org/Articles/AF10001999.htm

HTN: Ready to put something on tape?
AF: Sure.

HTN: O.K. So, what do you think of Bill Clinton?
AF: I'll tell you what Kirk - at this point I really don't know what to think. One minute I think one thing and the next minute I think something else. It's a pretty complex situation to say the least. It's easy to dismiss him as out of hand and it's easy to root for him - I'm just really kind of disgusted with the whole situation.

HTN: Yeah, I watch the news all the time. I mean, I missed 1974 and most of 1975 and I promised myself I wouldn't let that happen again. I was just unconscious for a couple of years, and everything that I had been railing against and working for and protesting and marching for…I basically slept through it when it all came to an end. We ran Nixon out of the White House and the Vietnam War and all of that shit was over. Eventually, I cleaned up and cleared up and thought, "Wow, how did that happen?" So I watch the news like a junkie, but I'm bored to tears with this stuff.

AF: And really, for me, it wasn't so much what he did as it was how he handled himself in the aftermath. That's the kind of thing that really kind of…those are the negatives, the real negatives.

HTN: Yeah. Well, that's not what I called to talk about anyway. So where are you from?
AF: I was born in Alexandria, Virginia, because my dad was in the Army up there, but I moved around 'till I was about nine. My family root, as far as my mother's side, are in South Eastern North Carolina - down near Wilmington. I come from a small town there called Burgaw, which has about 2000 people. So, I was pretty much out in the middle of nowhere.

HTN: I grew up in Iowa in the same kind of town, a little-bity place.
AF: Yeah, I mean, when we got a Fast Fare I remember being excited because there was some kind of change. Something was coming to town, you know.

HTN: Yeah, I do know.
AF: I figured, now I'll be able to go out and get a Creem Magazine without having to drive into Wilmington.

HTN: Where were you born? How old are you?
AF: I'm 36. I was born October 5th, 1962.

HTN: Oh yeah? October 9th, 1950.
AF: I hear you. So you're a Libra, too.

HTN: Uh huh. So what did you first listen to? What stirred you into this?
AF: As far as playing, I don't know. As a kid I think that I always, somewhere within the deep recesses of the brain, knew that I was going to play music. Of course I was too busy getting caught up in doing the things little kids do. I was playing in the sandbox and shooting people with cowboy guns and all of that stuff. I had a couple friends who played, and it was really sort of a question of…I really wasn't good at sports or any of that kind of thing, and I think that I was sort of interested in it. But then my folks decided, "Well hey why don't you take some lessons if you're really impressed by your buddies playing?" So they signed me up and I took a few lessons and had a little bit of an aptitude for it and the teacher sent me on my way, and I just kinda kept pulling the needle back on the old turn table and teaching myself in my room.

HTN: So you started off with guitar?
AF: I started out playing guitar, but I used to beat on things around the house like all kids did, and I think that was sort of a sign that I was hearing the music.

HTN: Do your folks play music?
AF: My mom plays piano - she used to play in church when I was a kid. My dad was not really musical that I know of, but he enjoyed music and we always had music around the house. My dad was a big fan of Country music back when Country music was Country music. When I was a kid he was always playing George Jones or Hank Snow records - things of that nature. My mom was into stuff like Tom Jones, so I was kind of getting a real cross-section of sounds and things, and that stuff sticks with you. I think that is a lot of the reason why I still enjoy stuff like George and things like that these days.

HTN: Oh yeah, I love Country music. That was half of what I grew up listening to.
AF: Right. There are a lot of people that I know that are my age and still don't like it. I think that they just didn't hear it at an early age, but I remember that when I was a little kid and I heard it, and before I became aware of the "cool" factor, I would listen to it. Then all of a sudden around my neck of the woods it was determined that if you listened to it then you were a hick or a redneck. So I had to go through all of that and then rediscover it when I got a bit older and was able to say, "Wait a second, there's nothing dumb about this."

HTN: No, I think that is exactly the way things normally flowed for…I mean it happened to me and a lot of people I know…I have tons of Country albums that I went back and bought in the 80's. I grew up in the 50's listening to it, but it didn't make any sense through the 60's and 70's.
AF: Right, I hear you. And all of the stuff I was getting was before the outlaw movement of the 70's, too. So I was getting my Dave Dudley truck driving years and all of that stuff. Hee-Haw every Saturday night - I'm sure you had that, too.

HTN: Yep. Well, that's cool. So when you started buying your own stuff, what did you buy?
AF: I think that the first record I bought as a kid, before I even started playing music, maybe was a Three Dog Night single.. You know, some stuff that I was hearing on the radio. That was back when you could listen to the radio and actually hear good music. I remember specifically as a small child hearing Santana, theYes, and Sly & The Family Stone, and then Creedence, and then Al Green and Chuck Berry - all on the same radio station. So, I feel real fortunate to have been an impressionable kid at that point in time, as far as that goes. That all stays with you, it really does. But I remember hearing, as far as when I started playing guitar, I heard "Rocky Mountain Way" on the radio and "Scholl's Out" by Alice Cooper and all of these things that sounded so great on the mono AM speakers, and thinking, "Wow." So then I started exploring that. I remember that when I first started out I guess I had a couple of KISS albums or something. You know, the same thing that all the kids had at that time. I had a buddy named Ernie Johnson who is a fantastic guitar player - he was the only guy in the next county who played guitar - the musical community was pretty small. He was a few years older than me and I remember him saying, "Now these KISS records are alright, I understand where you are coming from, but why don't you come over with me to my buddy's house." So I remember that we rode through the woods, literally through the tree line to this trailer and he said, "You sit here" - he had an old Ford van. It was a really typical scene right out of the movies. He was like, "You sit here and I'm going to go inside." I was too dumb and young at the time - I kind of figured that out later. He came back out and he had a Mountain record - Twin Peaks Live I think is what it was. He also told me that I needed to check out the Allman Brothers' Fillmore album. So I have to really thank him for turning me in that direction. I was lucky, and still am, to have had a lot of mentors that were a couple of years older and a few IQ points ahead of me.

HTN: Now, in this settling into the Raleigh period - when did that happen?
AF: That was about 1989, about ten years ago
.
HTN: That's when you put Cry of Love together?
AF: Yeah. We rehearsed for a while and we had a singer who didn't work out. It was me and Robert Kearns, the bass player, and Jason Patterson on drums. Jason had done the same thing out on the circuit - the cover band circuit thing. Eventually we signed Haley Holland as our singer in the fall of '91, and by summer of '92 we were already negotiating our deal with Columbia to make a record for them. We never did really get a chance to develop a real strong regional following outside of the record label - we didn't really beat the bushes around here with that band and establish like a college-type following. I'm not sure that we could have, just because the music was really sort of Rock 'n' Roll, and I'm not sure we would have been able to infiltrate a lot of the more "intellectual" market with stuff like that.

HTN: Yeah - especially at that time period. There was a lot of West Coast Seattle stuff happening at that point.
AF: Exactly. That stuff was really getting big when our first record came out.

HTN: Well I remember when that record, The Cry of Love, first came out, and that was the same time period that there was a band from Alabama called Brother Cain.
AF: Yep. Our records came out just about identically.

HTN: That's what I was thinking. I don't know what was in my head about that, but I remember hearing both of those records for the first time around the same time.
AF: And I wasn't aware of those guys. Somebody had said something about Brother Cain and I was like, "No, never heard of them," and then we played down at the Nick in Birmingham - I'm sure a lot of people are familiar with that. We were playing there and these guys came out and I recognized one of them. I was like, "That's that cat Damon that I knew from…" - they had been out on the same circuit that we had, the cover band circuit. Lo and Behold, that was Brother Cain, and we had been, at worst, acquaintances before that - we became friends after that. That was sort of interesting that we both existed, and Damon said the same thing - that he had heard the Cry of Love tape and had no idea that that was who it was. It's a small world.

HTN: Well, I liked that stuff. Both of you guys, them and y'all. I though, now this is good, this makes sense. You guys went out toured with a bunch of people didn't you? A bunch of opening slots?
AF: Yeah, we did the standards. We did some Aerosmith shows and we did some stuff with ZZ Top. We did some Robert Plant stuff and a couple of shows over in Europe with multiple bands - just one offs and things like that.

HTN: Had you toured Europe before?
AF: No.

HTN: Yeah. The Crowes just got back, actually. There are certain things about it that are obviously fantastic, but when you get back to the States and you look at the ground you think "Wow. I didn't realize how much I missed this convenience."
HTN: Like ice and air conditioning for instance.
AF: Yeah - good point. And Mountain Dew.

HTN: But you can get wienerschnitzel on palm fritz all over the place. When I first went to Europe that was all I ordered - wienerschnitzel and palm fritz, because I could eat pork and potatoes.
AF: Right. There is a lot of wonderful food over there, but at the same time salted dried ham and hard bread and cheese after a while can be a little much.

HTN: So what do you listen to now?
AF: What do I listen to now? That bounces all over the place. I got a bunch of bootleg tapes from Japan and today I watched a Little Feat show from 1977 and I watched an Elton John thing from back in 1970 when he just had the trio - it was just him and Nigel Olsen and Dee Murray. But I've been listening to that Lucinda Williams record a lot - Car Wheels on a Gravel Road - that's fantastic. I've been listening to some old Fleetwood Mac stuff, back with Peter Green. That's been a fairly heavy rotation. I bought a bunch of stuff when I was in Japan, so I haven't been able to really…you know when you get a whole pile of new stuff, singling out one thing is kind of hard. As far as new stuff goes, the new Sheryl Crow record I think is good. I got a good Stevie Wonder bootleg while I was over there too.

HTN: Living in Raleigh, are you around much? Since you joined the Crowes you obviously aren't there too much.
AF: No, not too much. I mean my time at home this time is a week.

HTN: I've been listening to a fair amount of stuff that's been coming out of Raleigh. All of this…Whiskeytown for instance, the Backsliders, you know, a lot of that shitkicker music played by young punks.
AF: Yeah, the drummer from the Backsliders is a good friend of mine. He and I played together out on the cover band circle. But they have since kind of mutated and only the singer is left. I used to teach guitar lessons and work at a music store with another guy who is in the backsliders. It was kind of big…I hesitate to use the word "scene," because that wasn't what it was. But everybody used to get together and do some picking, we'd sit around and listen to some tunes, you know. Good stuff, though.

HTN: Now that is the feeling that I got, that there isn't really a scene in Raleigh. Is there or isn't there?
AF: They try to perpetuate it in the local newspapers and stuff, but I think that there is a little pocket. It's just like everywhere else. You hang out with the people that you hang out with and then you end up doing what you do with them. It's kind of that way. We were always kind of ignored up here as far as the local papers and things like that, but we would always sell out wherever we played. But there is no shame in that.

HTN: Hell no. I don't think much of most writers anyway, but then again here I sit.
AF: At least you don't have an agenda and you are honest. You gather the facts.

HTN: Well, that is what we try to do, just lay it out. I don't write stories, I publish interviews. I mean 85 or 90 percent of what is printed is going to be exactly what is coming out of your mouth, I read a lot of people that are really good writers, but then they inject a little bit too much of themselves into the situation.
AF: It's all about them instead of the subject.

HTN: Right, I mean nobody gives a rat's ass about what I think. Then again, they might not care what you think. - I'm banking that they do. So how did this thing come up with the Crowes?
AF: We finally called an end to the Cry of Love thing in August of '97. You can beat your head against the wall for so long before you have to say the wall has won. It was time to walk away. I got home from the tour that we had finished on a Saturday night and I was talking to a couple of friends about doing some playing with them, but on Wednesday somebody came up to the coffee shop where I was and said that the Black Crowes needed a guitar player. Scott Carl, who was the drummer in a band called Building Fence who had toured with the Crowes, said that he called them and told them to put my name in the hat. I was like, "What?" You know, I had had the Cry of Love thing for about eight years and then I get three days off and this comes up. So basically it was sort of through mutual friends. I've got to thank those guys - Scott and a guy named Johnny Arion, who was in Building Fence also. They made a couple of calls on my behalf. I thought that it was interesting, so my whole quest at that point was to get an audition. I thought, "Well, it can't hurt." So I actually kind of called up some people that I knew and asked them to put in a word for me.

HTN: Had you gone and seen the Crowes?
AF: Oh yeah, I was real familiar with them. I wore that Amorica record out. That's fantastic.

HTN: That's the best they've done, I think.
I was well aware of them. I had been to see them and all. I knew a couple of the guys, but not enough to call it a friendship or anything. That was once again back from the cover band circuit days. So, I was real familiar and I was a fan. I thought that it would be a really good opportunity for me, so I went down in October and auditioned. We played a few songs.

HTN: This was in Atlanta?
AF: This was in Atlanta. Chris wasn't there and Eddie wasn't there. Rich had given me a list of like nine songs to learn on Monday and I went down on a Friday.

HTN: So it was Sven and Steve and Rich and you?
AF: I walked in on the first song and was using his amp and had a problem with it. Rich was like, "Did you blow it up?" So I'm thinking, "This is getting off to a great start!" So we took a break and we came back and we played one more song. We had only played seven out of the nine and it was a Friday afternoon and they were like, "Look man, if you leave now you can get back to Raleigh and beat rush hour traffic." I was sitting there thinking that maybe it wasn't great, but I didn't think it sucked that bad!

HTN: And they wanted you to hurry out of town.
AF: They were shooting me on out, and at that point I thought that that was that. I had tried, because I think they had tried out some fairly well-known cats - I know some of the guys they tried out were really good players. But they called me back on the following Monday and were like, "Sit tight," but I think that they decided just to go with what they had as far as the record went - they did it themselves. Then when it came time to tour they gave me a call back, and we had kind of stayed in touch, so it was kind of funny. It was kind of like serendipity, crossing paths here and there and a lot of weird things happening. Eddie and Sven are both trying to convince me that there is no such thing as coincidence. The more I keep my eyes open the more I think that they are right - that destiny is a real thing.

HTN: Yeah, I live with that. I know that is fact. You know, as you're telling the story and I'm hearing all these things. When did the call ultimately come?
AF: I can't really remember how long it was. I had amassed a collection of bootleg videos and things like that because I wanted to be on my toes about it. I knew that they were famous for stretching things out quite a bit and I kind of wanted to be aware of what was happening. So I was keeping up with it all of the while and was writing songs. I wasn't counting on it, but I didn't want to count it out. I guess that was in the middle of May and I went down on June 1st or something like that. We played our first gig on the 17th or 19th.

HTN: And that was on the club tour, Sho' Nuff - the shakedown thing?
AF: Yeah, and that really just ended - if you count that show in Tokyo - last week. We did around 75 shows.

HTN: Well I've got a few of them on tape. I haven't seen any - I live in Macon and we don't get anything down here and I'm gone a lot anyway. But I've got a lot of people who send me a lot of tapes and I've probably got 8 or 10 of the stuff since you've been playing with them. Obviously, the thing that everyone is talking about, the tone and the shape of the record is going back is going back to the ballbusting of the first two - the first one specifically - and I like that. However, I love that long spacey tripped out stuff that they were doing - I really do. Working for this band and working for the Mule. I know about all of that stuff. I know how things evolve and how things change, and how chords build and edges break…all of that kind of shit. I read a little thing in the paper the other day where Gorman was saying, "Hey, at least we're honest. Whatever we played was exactly what it was at the time we were playing it - it's not like we were trying to be anything for anybody at any given moment." Chris going barefoot and wearing long beards and overalls and playing on the H.O.R.D.E. tour or the Furthur Fest - all of that stuff was exactly where they were then. And coming back to this thing is…if I programmed a radio station there would probably be about 85 people listening to it.
AF: Me too. I could run some people off real quick.

HTN: I have. There was a radio station here in Macon that gave me two and a half hours one time, and they didn't do that a second time.
AF: I'm going to have a few people over to my house tonight for a "listening" party. I'm sure that I will drive them nuts with a couple of things.

HTN: I played three Gary Stewart records in a row on a rock station. They didn't dig it. But the thing is, I really love the whole spirit that these boys play with. I love them as guys - I'm closer to a couple of them than the rest, but I'm really fond of them and I really like them and what they do. I have always liked the fact that they don't give a rat's ass. "Fuck you, this is a commercial break, I ain't playing on this fucker." Or that whole wise-ass, loud mouth groove that they do is wonderful. And I have watched brothers fight all of the time. So I think that you jumped into a real fun time.
AF: It's great. And to be honest with you, it gets more comfortable and fun everyday, and that is a blessing for me. But I have been having a tremendous time, and I think that this was the record that they needed to make. I think that Steve Gorman was right about the honesty thing. I think that this is the record that they felt inside of them at this point. And good for them - like you were saying and Steve was saying, they aren't going to cower down to expectations of the Furthur crowd - they don't feel like they have to do anything for those folks. And the Shake Your Money Maker crowd - they didn't cater to them when they decided to make some more exploratory music.

HTN: I've always watched it, and obviously I'm not sure how the dynamics play in the management/band organization, but I've seen them come into town and play smaller places than they could because you leave town with a sold out show and people wanting to have been there, rather than play the next place up that holds 3,000 more and only selling 2,000 tickets. So you create these things. Like opening acts - so many bands pick opening acts based on how the tickets are going to sell. Well, to hell with that. Let's put the Dirty Dozen Brass Band up there. It ain't going to sell shit, but it is going to be a great show.
AF: And it's going to inspire the audience and the musicians.

HTN: See, the boys that I work for don't do that - the Brothers aren't about that, so I admire and respect all of that stuff. Watching things evolve that way, these guys do what is honest and suffer the consequences or reap the benefits, whichever happens. You've got to respect that. I mean, playing the Pot Fest, let's not draw too much heat to ourselves.
AF: Let's not stay under the radar.

HTN: So dynamics on stage - how does that work?
AF: I've been encouraged to step up to the plate even more than I thought that I should, so who can argue with that? I found that once I got beyond these boundaries I had set for myself, that it actually does work for everybody - the audience and the band. I really think that I'm beginning to find my feet as far as that goes. It takes a little time - as it should. These guys have been playing together for 12 years and I've been playing with them for six months. So it's going to take a little time, but whenever the guys have a smile on their face when we finish a song then everything must be alright.

HTN: So do you find yourself in a situation where you find yourself feeling like you need to play Marc's stuff from time to time?
AF: Yeah, sure. I mean, I'm not going to compare myself with Warren on any level, but I'm sure he faced a similar dilemma, although the guy that he replaced was in a Pantheon - no disrespect to Marc Ford, but there is only one Duane Allman. But I think that it is really easy for me to sort out. You just do what serves the song, and if there is a part that was there and if I was listening to the record and all of a sudden that part wasn't there, it would twist my ear and the part stays the same.

HTN: Don't just change it for the sake of changing it and it being yours.
AF: Right. I'm not out there to prove what Audley Freed can do on the guitar. It's lets make the band sound good. I've got plenty of leeway, but there are definitely certain things that should be played out of respect for the song. This guy came up to me in Toronto the other night and said, "You need to improvise more and not play the solos like they are on the record." I said, 'First off, cuz, I do improvise all night and #2, have a little respect for the music - how about it." He started going, "No man - I do respect the music." I said, "Well the think about it."

HTN: Good call. Now is that the exception rather than the rule? Obviously the Crowe fan base is very close to the band. Crazed hard cores like we have with the Brothers or the Mule - there is that core of maniacal followers. Do you feel received, or like an interloper - how's it coming?
AF: I think that it is taking a little while, obviously, as it should. But I think that the people who have ears, whose opinion would matter to me if I met them one on one - I think that they have been very accepting, because they can hear and they can see and they can understand what is happening. It's not like a football team, where your favorite players leave…it's not sports - it's all about the music. So I think that will improve as time goes forward.

HTN: So traveling, touring conditions are improved?
AF: Yeah, about 1,000%. The tour bus that we had for Cry of Love was a 15 passenger Ford van. It made the rounds. So, I don't even know how to start with that. It was kind of an eye opening, mind-blowing experience. I am very thankful to be able to have the opportunity to do it in style.

HTN: It's cool. I go out with the Mule sometimes when the Brothers aren't on the road, because I used to tour manage for both of them. And, there was a big change. It was interesting watching Warren and Allen come from being employees of the Allman Brothers to running their own show. What are you willing to go through in order to perpetuate your own groove - you respect that. It's interesting to see how people carry their own weight when it is their own weight to carry.
AF: Right. Well I think that obviously Allen and Warren are real people first and are real musicians. I bet that they don't even think twice about it. It's what you do. It isn't like those guys don't come from that.

HTN: Yeah, but after ten years of a certain way of living you wonder if they can get back into it.
AF: It just shows you what they're made of.

HTN: So, you look good on that stage - I'll tell you that. When I heard you got the gig I thought, "Now that will match. That will look great." One of the guys that I had heard was Haynes' buddy, Mike Barnes, and he is a smoking player…but I couldn't see how that would translate visually. He was a little too conservative looking for me, and I thought, "Not with that wild bunch." But you are holding your own on that level, too. I think it's cool.
AF: It's great. Like I said it just gets more and more fun as time goes on. For these guys to confide in me and my musicianship means a whole lot to me., because they could treat me like hired help but it has been a whole lot different than that.

HTN: Did you know Sven?
AF: I didn't know him one bit. But he is a fine fellow and an amazing player.

HTN: Eddie's a treat ain't he?
AF: Eddie is awesome.

HTN: Eddie is keyboards for your ass, there ain't no two ways about it. Him and a buddy I guess came to Pine Knob when we were playing, and you see them strolling in, and it is like the MC5 coming into town.
AF: Eddie is what you call a "cat" if there ever was one.

HTN: Yes sir. I love him. I love all of them. Rich is aloof but I like him - we've had great chats. He is a serious cat, or maybe not…that's just my perception. Well, I am happy for you and I'm pulling for you and it's going to work, there ain't no doubt about it.
AF: Well thanks man. Coming from you, I appreciate the hell out of that. Are you guys touring this summer?

HTN: Yeah, we'll probably start the third week of June or the second week of June, something like that.
AF: So I imagine that you'll be coming through Walnut Creek at some point.

HTN: Oh yeah - and Charlotte no doubt.
AF: Hopefully it will be where I can come out.

HTN: Well, you've got that number, keep it in your pocket because I check the machine everyday. If you see us coming through and we are going to cross paths, just holler. The others know that too.
AF: Definitely - you know I will.